COMMENT 317205P
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2012-09-07 09:18 AM |
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After reading this stuff, I went to Google Maps to confirm my location. It appears I am still in the U.S.A., the land of justice and freedom. Where people are innocent of crimes until proven guilty of them beyond a reasonable doubt. Where we don't use revenge as the moving force in our justice system. Most of you who want Attias locked up for the rest of his life are ignoring the fact he was not convicted of the crime charged. He was - IS - not guilty. But, because he was insane and a danger to society, he was put in a state hospital for treatment. Once his is not insane anymore, we have no reason, nor authority, to lock him up. Yes, it is against the law to kill people. But it is also against the law to lock up people not convicted of a crime, who are not a danger to themselves or others. Laws. Bedrock. USA. Love it or leave it.
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COMMENT 317203
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2012-09-07 09:16 AM |
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What makes anyone think he will need a driver's license if he has another psychotic break and again becomes the angel of death. I'm going to go ahead and assume he won't care much about a ticket for driving without a license while he's on a rampage killing people. The courts have taugh him one valuable lesson however. He can always blame his mental illness for the wrongs he does.
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COMMENT 317126P
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2012-09-07 05:54 AM |
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Yes, SY, there is such a thing as right and wrong. I read philosophy, too.
Empirically, I am right, you are wrong on this subject. In the case of this monster, all of you can try and shift the blame for his actions anywhere you wish, if that makes you feel better. It was him, Attias, who did that act, no one else. His life ended the same day he took those innocent children's lives. It was an awful act of murder, or a tragic accident...whatever, his, Attias' life ended that day.
I don't care about him, I care about the kids he murdered and their families.
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RAINE5360
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2012-09-06 08:37 PM |
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I sympathize with the mentally ill, but is this really the solution? What if he does this again? Can he ever really be normal knowing what he's done? I hope to god he never gets a drivers license.
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COMMENT 317065P
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2012-09-06 06:38 PM |
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I've lived with mental illness and lived with others who have mental illness. I have had many disturbing thoughts and have had the SENSE not to voice them or carry them out. I keep those thoughts to myself and no one else. When I contemplate carrying out those ideas, I consider the consequences of those actions and work on more productive ideas.I began having those thoughts as a young teen and still have them over 20 years later. No criminal activity, no convictions, no unemployment or disability. Just another productive worker in SB.
This person clearly does not have the ability to restrain himself from doing harm to others. I believe he should remain locked up. If he is unable to remain locked up, then he should be released to the custody of his guardians and that they and the judge who released him should be held accountable for all of his actions hence forth.
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COMMENT 316871
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2012-09-06 12:42 PM |
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You know what is right and wrong to you, 697P.There is no empirical right or wrong. For example, you believe in the death penalty. I don't. That doesn't mean that you are right and I am wrong or vice versa, we simply have differing opinions. But you can keep going on about your great and grand accomplishments and try and inflate your ego and make yourself feel like your values are the absolute "right" values. That's your prerogative.
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COMMENT 317126P
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2012-09-06 12:22 PM |
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421: I am sure you feel you are "evolved" and smarter than Neanderthals like myself. You may be right. I do not suffer from decision paralysis or second guessing myself. I know what is right and wrong. People like me built and gave you everything you have. I did manage to graduate college (MIT and Harvard, thanks), raise a family, build multiple successful businesses and contribute $$millions to the poor, hungry, and unfortunate.
How about you?
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DEE D
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2012-09-06 10:24 AM |
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Life is a process, and through living all of us change - living organism or organizations are always in the process of either getting more functional, or becoming less functional, because every action creates feedback loops, positive or negative. Human lives have a general trajectory - the peak period for psychotic breaks is young adulthood, not to say that some unfortunately remain broken and unable to function. But some are able to develop coping strategies (including medication and social supports) and go on to live satisfying lives. There are no guarantees for any of us that we will stay on track, and if we go off track, we almost certainly will not readjust without one another's help. Is David Attias more likely than someone without his past to have future difficulties? No doubt. Hopefully the continued support the court has ordered will indeed be present in his life. Life has no guarantees. We cannot kill every risk. How safe our communities are depends on how much we are willing to give to support people like David, and even better, to catch them before they fall. That is where we all should be focused. The primitive anger centers of our middle brain strike out all to easily, but such response has never resolved the fact that we will always have imperfect people with whom to deal. We can devise increasingly effective methods of doing so, but we must collectively determine to do so.
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COMMENT 316716P
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2012-09-06 07:45 AM |
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97P-thank you. You couldn't have said any better-Old Testament thinking at its finest.
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COMMENT 317126P
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2012-09-06 07:15 AM |
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Was there, remember...4 young people dead because of him
Listen to yourselves....
-parents to blame? Don't care
-mental illness? Don't care
-pharma to blame? Don't care
-justice system to blame? Don't Care
-2nd chance at life? Seriously Don't Care!
-Compassion? Sorry, fresh out. Don't Care Don't Care Don't Care Don't Care!!!...
He did this, He murdered those kids. He should have been executed. What happened to common sense? If it was my kid who got murdered by this monster, I would want him released too...and you know why.
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COMMENT 316716P
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2012-09-05 11:40 PM |
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This is a thought provoking case. As modern as we think we are, our justice system is trapped in the Old Testament of the Bible. That is why we have one of the world's largest populations of prisoners. Other countries have smaller prison populations because they believe in rehabilitation and actually rehabilitate the convicted. We still don't believe in rehabilitation as is demonstrated by the disfunction of our justice system and by many of the comments on this board. It is time to move forward and modernize our justice system.
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COMMENT 316652P
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2012-09-05 08:12 PM |
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@ ROGER DODGER - Oooh. Harsh, harsh, harsh. I always thought you were a compassionate person. You are accepting of poor people, potheads, the downtrodden and those amongst us who others view as vermin. David Attias suffers from an illness that he didn't ask to have or deserve to have. It has ruined his life, as well as the lives of many others. Given your chronicles of your escapade in earlier years, I'm sure you have hurt and insulted others. Hopefully you have never done anything to contribute to anyone's death. But tormenting and bothering others is very bad and frankly, inexcusable. This is why I would think that you, of all posters, would understand that rehabilitation is possible if the offender is simply given the chance to show his goodness. Sorry to say I'm no longer a "fan" of Roger the Scanner Guy.
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COMMENT 316640
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2012-09-05 07:32 PM |
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The parents are to blame.
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ROGER DODGER
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2012-09-05 05:03 PM |
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My opinion he deserves the Death Penality. I think if he pulls that behavior in Ventura he will get it before the police get him, or maybe in jail. I've had problems most of my life that doesn't give me the right to put people in a WOOD CHIPPER even though sometimes I want to.
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DILLYDALLY
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2012-09-05 04:52 PM |
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Those posters demanding accountability are 100% correct, the Judge and Drs responsible for his release should also be accountable if he decides not to take his meds. If he kills more people or commits any other crimes when (not if) he stops taking his meds, the Judge and Drs will say "how could we have known, he promised to stay on his meds". Hold them accountable for his actions on and off treatment. If his normal state is to be violent, that makes him a criminal. They only thing pleading insanity in cases like this should get you is some therapy in prison.
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COMMENT 316556
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2012-09-05 04:41 PM |
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At the time of the murders of those four students, I believe his last words to his fellow dormies at Francisco Torres was something about going out to get laid before he rammed his car into crowds of students. The ruling on his release claims he was still writing "inappropriate" letters to a young woman at the facility where he was in custody. Why did Judge Adams brush over that disturbing incident?
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COMMENT 316548P
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2012-09-05 04:25 PM |
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He should have had a medication holiday while still safely in custody to see what happens when the core personality emerges. Is the angel of death just below the surface still? That way we would know what the risks will be when he eventually conducts this experiment himself.
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COMMENT 316540
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2012-09-05 04:14 PM |
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Maybe Attias can further rehab through rooster adoption.
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COMMENT 316533
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2012-09-05 03:59 PM |
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I am loving all the arm-couch-couch-papas shrinks in the peanut gallery. The EXPERTS made their decision...get over it and move on! Judge Adams was elected into his seat by people just like you!
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COMMENT 316540
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2012-09-05 03:48 PM |
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Before too long he will be able to purchase firearms and drive heavy equipment.
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COMMENT 316522
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2012-09-05 03:42 PM |
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This is too soon for his release. But, I really had hoped that this would spark more debate and criticism about the current state of medication and the number of people who walk around and drive in our area on meds like Attias was on. I believe he was mentally unstable, absolutely. But I also think that it was proven in court that his condition was made worse by the medication he was taking. His parents were at fault for pretending (or hoping?) that he was okay enough to go to college like a "normal" kid and sending him away to UCSB with what was ultimately a lethal weapon, the car. But I do think that we need to take a good, long look at how anti-depressive and anti-psychotic drugs are prescribed in this country and the effect that pharmaceuticals can have on people's ability to manage their mental illness. I'm not 100% sure I feel comfortable thinking this was entirely mental illness and not something that was made worse by medication.
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COMMENT 316501
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2012-09-05 03:15 PM |
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Too soon that's all.
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COMMENT 316473
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2012-09-05 02:23 PM |
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Wow, they're releasing the angel of death... anything is possible
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COMMENT 316454
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2012-09-05 01:55 PM |
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406 I completely agree. 421P call them whatever you want this person should be in one. Mentally disabled is used to cover too many conditions. I know many mentally disables children, teens, and adults. They are wonderful people who deserve to have a great life with all of the same freedoms and rights as anyone else. They are not murderers who blame their medication for their actions. Mental institutions should be available for the incarceration of any individual who decides to use the insanity plea and wins. If you are insane enough to kill fine you don't have to go to jail, you have to be locked up in a mental institution for the criminally insane.
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COMMENT 316449
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2012-09-05 01:48 PM |
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Yeah, it's not like Reagan could have vetoed Lanterman-Petris-Short... Oh wait, he could have. At any rate I don't think that part of the debate really amounts to anything more than spilled milk. What's done is done. The problem is that our current system, I think, is woefully under-prepared and not well equipped to handle people like Attias who require medication to have any hope of functioning like "regular" human beings. Sad.
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COMMENT 316556
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2012-09-05 01:36 PM |
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Yeah, it is tough when a governor has to carry out the rulings of an ACLU lawsuit and put people better served in state care institutions out on to the streets to fend for themselves. Thank an ACLU member for their enlightened vision for the most vulnerable amongst us. And since Reagan opened those doors almost 50 years ago in the 1960's, those now on the streets in 2012 will need to thank someone else for their continued degraded life condition. Attias does not deserve a new life or new freedom because there is blood on his hands and he should never be able to not think about it every single day for the rest of his life. That is what forgiveness is all about - a daily atonement forever, when acts were has heinous as his.
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COMMENT 316533
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2012-09-05 01:26 PM |
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I for one and happy to hear our system was able to help him enough to allow him to be released. He deserves a new life. Find some love and forgiveness in your hearts. He is human and he made a mistake and now he is being given a second chance. Let go of the hate. It will destroy you. I will pray for your hateful remarks.
Dear David, please go and enjoy your new found freedom. Peace and love to all!
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COMMENT 316716P
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2012-09-05 12:44 PM |
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Did you mean to say the concentration camps for the mentally disabled?
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COMMENT 316409
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2012-09-05 12:20 PM |
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If only a certain governor hadn't facilitated the closing of most of this state's mental institutions...
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COMMENT 316540
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2012-09-05 12:14 PM |
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So we're going to pay to put him in a low security half way house so he can take pottery classes and live a free life? We're going to do this After he's killed 4 people and irreveocably taken the livelihood of another, and has done unmeasurable hurt to all the family, friends, and our community?
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COMMENT 316406
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2012-09-05 12:10 PM |
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I cant' believe the excuses being made for this low-life. If your one pill away from "insanity" and murder then you shouldn't be released! If your normal state of mind without your drugs or pills is to want to murder others...I'm supposed to feel safe around you because you promise to take your pills??? Prisons are built for people like Attias, he murdered in cold blood with plenty of evidence to prove it, lock this guy away with all the other murderers where he belongs!! The 'judge' who ordered his release should be fired and thrown in prison with Attias!!!
@354 It's a true miracle??? Really??? Check the definition of miracle!! ....This is a true INJUSTICE!!
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COMMENT 316404P
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2012-09-05 12:06 PM |
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385 has it right. I think that Judge Adams and the psychologists who declared him not a threat should be made to live with their families next door to where ever David Attias is placed. The psychologist who worked with him prior to the IV incident said he was not a threat also. There are mental illnesses that will never be "cured" and control is ify and on a day to day basis. Allowing him out is a travesty.
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SHOREBIRD
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2012-09-05 12:02 PM |
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In psychiatry the best predictor of future behavior is past behavior.
Holf your breath Ventura and be wary.
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COMMENT 316556
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2012-09-05 11:52 AM |
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There are valid reasons for state institutions. This is one of them. More need to be opened. There are people who cannot and will not live within the bounds of safe society - either to themselves or to others. This is okay and we should do this because the alternative of main-streaming people who in turn harm others or themselves is not working. We know this and the answer is simple: state care institutions where both society and the person are safe.
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COMMENT 316393
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2012-09-05 11:36 AM |
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369P: If only it were that simple. There is an untold number or reasons why those with mental illness go off their meds. Most often, they think they can deal without. It's not like they decide, "Hey, I am going off these pills and the hell with whatever happens." They think they can handle it. They want to be normal. It's not a rational, malicious decision to go off meds.
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COMMENT 316385
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2012-09-05 11:22 AM |
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The psychologist he was seeing before he killed those people did not know he was a danger to others or they would have had to report it to the police. The psychologist who says he is now better doesn't know if he is really better, either. It's an inexact science, and I use the word science very loosely. The only fair thing to do is to tie the fate of the judge and psychologist to the fate of Mr Attias and if he kills and maims again then the judge and psych should be sent to jail too. Give them a stake in the outcome and see how suddenly they start to be very conservative about who they let out.
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COMMENT 316382
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2012-09-05 11:17 AM |
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David's father is a well-known director who has, in the past, directed many episodes of "House", "True Blood", "Six Feet Under", "Hung" and "Entourage" as well as many others. Funny how most have a drug and/or death theme.
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COMMENT 316369P
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2012-09-05 10:38 AM |
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324-They said he had his episode because he went off his medication. He made the decision to stop taking his medication, had an episode, and killed people. Why in the world should we now be worried about his "rights"? I have a sister with similar issues and yes meds are no fun but if she made the decision to stop taking them and then killed people I would feel the same. I would still love my sister but I would not think it was safe or right to have freedom again.
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COMMENT 316356
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2012-09-05 10:28 AM |
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330----I know, right?
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COMMENT 316533
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2012-09-05 10:23 AM |
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Ventura CONREP is an unlocked facility/group home. Mr. Aatias will travel via public transport to get any therapy he needs in VTA.
He is blessed to have another chance at life. May the angels watch over your life and you get all the treatment you need and deserve.
Its a true miracle!
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COMMENT 316393
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2012-09-05 10:19 AM |
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324: Thank you. Only until you have lived with someone with mental illness and have witnessed firsthand the struggle between the pros and cons of medication can you even begin to imagine the horror that goes on in the mind and brain of a mentally ill person. It is not an easy life. Why do you think there suicide rate of the mentally ill is astronomical?? They cannot live with their own demons. Saying that David Attias made a sane, deliberate, thought out decision to murder people is absurd.
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COMMENT 316346
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2012-09-05 10:04 AM |
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at the very least, let's not get him a car this time.
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COMMENT 316340
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2012-09-05 09:49 AM |
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How many and what meds was he on? How young was he when they started him on big pharma meds? The drug companies are likely co-defendants in a suit. It is so sad that so many of our kids are drugged legally.
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ROGER DODGER
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2012-09-05 09:47 AM |
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Ventura.
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COMMENT 316331
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2012-09-05 09:40 AM |
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315: He was ruled not guilty by reason of insanity. Charging him again for the same thing now that he's sane is double jeopardy (and illegal). I think 324 has a point. I don't know what it's like to have to take meds just to get by in life alright, and I really can't imagine it. I also agree with parts of MSSB - it's easier to be consistent with your meds when someone gets them ready for you, pays for them, and makes you take them in a controlled environment. I'm great at taking my vitamin at home - but once I go on vacation, I tend to forget when I'm not in my same old routine.
I think the situation sucks, but could be worse considering it's not like he's really being released - he's just going to another facility. At least for now.
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COMMENT 316540
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2012-09-05 09:38 AM |
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The next thing you know the state will pay for his windsurfing classes and get him a job in the k-8 school system.
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COMMENT 316324
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2012-09-05 09:24 AM |
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To anyone who has never had to take multiple meds a day prohibiting you from having a psychotic episode, you have no idea what it's like. We struggled with my sister's medication for 8 years, its not as simple as a doctor handing you a magic prescription that cures everything. In the end, she was better off without ANY meds. I think its very wrong to say he gave up his constitutional rights when he went off his.
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COMMENT 316316
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2012-09-05 09:14 AM |
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Sounds like he is stuck between a rock (his parents) and a hard place (life).
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COMMENT 316556
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2012-09-05 09:13 AM |
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Rich parents. Now that he is "sane", he needs to be tried for his horrific crimes and sentenced properly for the lives he took. He is a walking time bomb.
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COMMENT 316312
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2012-09-05 09:07 AM |
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As far as I am concerned Mr. Attias gave up his Constitutional Rights when he decided to stop taking his medication and killed innocent people. Of course he is doing better locked up, they make sure he gets his meds. What happens when he gets out and decides he is cured and stops taking the meds again? Who has to die before the system realizes if you kill someone you are never in a normal state of mind and you should never be allowed the opportunity to be free again. Normal sane people don't kill other people. Why in the world is there an insanity defense in the first place. Of course you are insane you killed someone!!
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COMMENT 316309
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2012-09-05 09:05 AM |
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303P...well said and I agree
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COMMENT 316356
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2012-09-05 09:01 AM |
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Well! They don't call it CRIMINAL JUSTICE for noth'n!
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COMMENT 316305
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2012-09-05 09:00 AM |
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Actually 303 you helped soften my blow; thanks for your insight, I must say I agree.
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COMMENT 316652P
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2012-09-05 08:56 AM |
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Good for Judge Adams and good for Public Defender Deedrea Edgar for working to protect our rights and freedoms under the U.S. Constitutional. Am I happy with the thing David Attias did? NO! Am I glad he was locked up and away from society so that he was unable to hurt and kill anyone else? YES! Do I believe he was mentally ill when he drove a car into his peers killing several of them, injuring others and terrorizing a community? YES! Do I think his parents are horrible people and largely to blame for the incident when the allowed and assisted David to come to Santa Barbara and attend college when he was clearly suffering from a severe mental illness? YES!!! Money will never bring back a child, but the correct remedy in this case is for the people who suffered and for those who lost children to sue Mr. Attias' parents for negligently ditching their sick son to a community 100 miles from home so they could continue their beautiful lives. David Attias will pay for his heinous act for the rest of his life, even if and when his mind is completely cleared of the mental illness he has suffered for many years. And we as a society need to treat him fairly and ensure that his Constitutional Rights are preserved, just as we want that for ourselves and the people of our community who we love and respect.
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COMMENT 316301
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2012-09-05 08:50 AM |
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I should be locked up for life!
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COMMENT 316300
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2012-09-05 08:49 AM |
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according to KTLA, an outpatient program at a location yet to be determined.
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COMMENT 316533
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2012-09-05 08:48 AM |
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God Bless him! I hope he does well in life.
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COMMENT 316295
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2012-09-05 08:45 AM |
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He should be in prison for life. It's a travesty of justice he is being released.
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COMMENT 316293
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2012-09-05 08:43 AM |
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Where will he be living?
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